thanks guys
My 1st 1 had the 4.5x4 IIRC I had that 1 for at least 15 years I miss it except for the bulky front it had . I wore it out this last 1 was given to me by an ex Dana Empl. and I know why too
I'll check out what Sm. Joe has , I got the Tig off him and can't thank him enough .