Paypal Peeve

[smart racer]

When I browse the classified section's on many rc forums...I do not understand when a seller ask's the the buyer to send money as a gift for a item...if the payment is sent as a gift the buyer has no protection if there is a problem with the transaction...also when the seller ask's for the the buyer to add/cover the Paypal fees...not allowed in Paypal's policy....correct if I am wrong - Steve

[fhhhstix]

I agree you wont have any protection and don't deserve any for being cheap. Those who specify paypal as a gift are pretty low they want to use paypal's time and resource's for free. Look at this way you go to work to get paid and if people don't pay your employer how are you going to get paid. Paypal is a great service and has opened up a lot of new possibilities.

Travis

[nenard]

Its about the best way thus far. No waiting for checks that never come or need to clear first. In some cases Ive paid the three percent in addition to the cost of the item. Its not always possible but I do it when I can. Both parties are protected and any problems Paypal works it out. Gift it and something happens your screwed.

[Smokin Joe]

Many sellers offer the option to send a money order. This method offers no protection. As far as paypal fees, I have spent thousands using paypal and see no harm using thier gift option.

[WhiteWolf McBride]

Smart Racer:

I dinna know that about loss of safety with the 'send as gift' option, and appreciate the heads up.

There is a growing alternative to PayPal, at least within Canada: Interac electronic email transfers http://www.interac.ca/

At present, it is only good within Canada (Canadian bank w/ Canadian funds), but that may change. My idjit nephew always sends me money that way, and its convenient as all he-ck.

As for PayPal fees - I often chip in to cover half the fees if I'm buying, and they offered a good price and are going the extra mile with "shipping issues" (aka the boneheads at Customs, and using USPS instead of couriers). There are a few retailers that ask for a 'subsidy', and because they have what I want, and at a better price even with the tack-on, I do it (non-eBay)

If I see it on eBay, I report 'em. They can have their seller status revoked for asking.

As for here... I think any seller that ASKS for the 'gift' option or the subsidy, should be noted and their buy/sell access revoked. Its like sales tax for a retailer, its the cost of doing business - don't like it, QUIT.

And for what its worth... 3% is MUCH less than ~any~ sales tax anywhere I know that HAS tax.

Just my 2 Cdn. coppers,
Whitewolf

[smart racer]

Smokin Joe: sending money as a "gift" may be what you are comfortable with, it is your choice... but I use Paypal for easy money transfer and "buyer protection"....like insurance, it is nice to know you have it, if you need it

[tc1cat]

As I am 1 of the "Cheapskates", I feel that I should voice my opinion on this. 1) If the recipient of the money is a business member he gets charged a fee for every transaction. So it is not 3% but whatever paypal wants to charge the business member. This is the fee for being a business member. 2) After so many transactions paypal will automatically change your status to an advantage member- takes over $5000 worth of transactions in 1 year. Mine was changed to this last month so I know this is a fact! 3) Why pay paypal to handle an electronic transaction? This is all done by computer with no one doing a thing. 4) Paypal is part of ebay now. With ebays' rising fees, do you really want to make them just that much more money? 5) Security??? Is there any real security in any of the ways to send money to someone for anything? NO!!! You can get ripped off even when each party does everything possible to get things right. Again, this is from experience. After having my paypal account changed I am now asking for money orders instead of using paypal. Again this is because I do not wish to have my paypal account changed again to a business member. Ebay is making enough money off of me as it is

[Espeefan]

Like anything else, it's always buyer beware. Especially on the internet, but that's why you should check trader feedback before you buy from someone on any forum. At least when you are planning on spending a bigger chunk of money. The request to gift money really doesn't bother me to much. As long as I can trust the seller. If you are concerned about packages gone missing, that's what shipping insurance, delivery confirmation, and tracking numbers are for. I always try to offer tracking and insurance on the more expensive items I send. Does pay-pal cover lost packages, or just dead beat sellers who never come through?

[spudd]

I have found that everyone I have delt with that asks for payment as a gift has in one way or another ended in a bad transaction!
If you are worried about the fees price your items to cover your fees or don't accept pay pal.

I stay clear of people that ask to be paid as a gift now!!!!!

[Tamiya Cowboy]

I have been screwed as a seller 3 times by PayPal as they don't listen to the seller one bit over 1,000 bucks worth I have given to PILES O SHYT out there.. I have had delivery confirmation on all 3 packages and had proof that it had been delivered and they reported it stolen and until the package is found I lose my money.. Well needless to say they have never been found and this was 3 different states one was yours Spudd and I have never seen any money..

Bottom line I send people PayPal as a gift all the time never have been screwed that way but I don't deal with newbees 2nd of all there fee's are nuts I have been with them for day one when it was .75% and Ill screw them every time just like there seller protection has done to me!


Oh yeah I am a advantage member too and they are there for you money not for YOU!

[fhhhstix]

When you use the gift option they know it and I bet they have totals on how much members use it. So if you use the gift option a lot how hard do you think they are going to help when you need it. I have used the gift option but if they question it I have no problem paying the fee and the other end of the party in the transaction had better man up as well. It is plain and simple they are a business and there to make money if you don't want to pay for the service don't use it. I look at it as using the gift option is no different than the person who says they didn't get the package you want something for nothing and you wander why the rates keep going up!!!

Travis

[ihbuilder]

As a seller , It's your choice how you send your $ thruogh paypal . yea it gets annoying with the fees , but **** someone once told me " you gotta pay to play " If you want to send a MO , but the stuff dosen't leave till the MO gets here or you can come pick it up with cash ,as some have .

[Tamiya Cowboy]

I was just reading on deal on this on a Blog just Google Paypal fees going up.. It said that there fees have went up but it was not to combat people getting around the fees as they have had a huge increase in profits in the last 5 years.. Thats great people need to make money and get paid but there comes a place on fair and unfair. Now I would never want a LOVELY GOVERNMENT to go after them like they did the banks but if you have the profits that they are having why raise the rates so high and if you are going to say that you protect buyers and seller and offer seller special protection then do it then the rate will be worth it but I have heard of so many seller on ebay getting stuck but paypal it is not even funny.. Read there seller rules it is say that if you have delivery confirmation on a package and it clears and the seller reports it stolen or damaged heavily then the seller is covered but I got screwed 3 times and I followed the rules and you can not get anyone on the phone no more just email and that works like a broke weiner.

[WhiteWolf McBride]

Guys (and gals?)

You each have your right to your own opinion. As do I, as do we all. Right?

I've been burned once on PayPal: the UK bugger took my money, then emptied & abandonned his account. PayPal got me 0.89 out of 100+ Euro. That hurt. But thats once in 10 years, and about 200 transactions.

Yes, I send money via gift to people I ~KNOW~ & ~TRUST~ (like Joe & Willy) But if a stranger asks me to, it'd be " Nope, sorry, thats a deal-breaker. " As for cheques or MO's, I don't send 'em. Filing for cross-border mail fraud and money recovery is just not worth the hassles. As for receiving 'em... OY. I almost got burned by Ken Meyer (the notorious Texas Thief) I'll accept an MO or cheque, sure, but I wait until my bank says its cleared before I post. PayPal goes out the same day.

As for Fees - PayPal skins us Canadians TWICE. You only wait 3-4 days for a transfer, they burn us for 6-8 days, even if the money is pulled from our account on day 1. They make 7 days worth of interest off us, so you guys got it EASY.

Customs? Heck, UPS & FedEx burn us on brokerage fees. USPS/Canada Post assessment is a flat $8.50 fee, plus any taxes (13% in Ontario) The couriers can burn us for whatever they want. I've been hit for 400% on a small styrene model ($15 off eBay). They don't leave parcel delivery notes, they've poked holes in boxes so they could carry them easily, and have stood $700 R/C models up on end (luckily I'd made sure seller packed the tank well). Unless I'm desperate, its USPS or nothing, because their service is as good for us Canucks as USPS is (if not better)

When all is said and done, Admin here has the right to make policy, and enforce it if they can/wish, its their forum after all, right? If my own policies (as above) prevent me from selling or buying here, so be it. Thats life.

But one note: ScaleLover dealt with me despite my being here under a week, he got paid promptly (damned Echeque 8-day delay) and though he's sick now, and his wife has to post for him, he made sure she checked with me to be sure the package went out the right way. Will I consider paying half (aka my fair share) of fees next time? Most likely.

Boycott eBay/PayPal it if you want, but don't expect others to conform to your policies. Transactions are two-sided (at least) and unless the parties involved agree to terms, it doesn't happen.

You both have your personal policies. Why argue about who is right? It only matters ~if~ you wanna deal with each other, or Admin sets a policy. Until then... Just CHILL.

And as Willy might suggest, go get a beer and a brat!

WhiteWolf
- patiently awaiting his package, & hoping ScaleLover feels better real soon.

[smart racer]

I was only trying to give the heads up on the "Gift" option which provides no protection to the uniformed buyer if there is a transaction problem. I was surprised and happy to learn the same...but lots of good opinion's guys

[Brian in PA]

I use the gift option when i do transactions between members here or people I know. On eBay I use the normal payment method.

Brian

[spudd]

Problem is you are making the buyer pay the fees

[fhhhstix]

Originally Posted by WhiteWolf McBride

When all is said and done, Admin here has the right to make policy, and enforce it if they can/wish, its their forum after all, right? If my own policies (as above) prevent me from selling or buying here, so be it. That's life.



Boycott eBay/PayPal it if you want, but don't expect others to conform to your policies. Transactions are two-sided (at least) and unless the parties involved agree to terms, it doesn't happen.

You both have your personal policies. Why argue about who is right? It only matters ~if~ you wanna deal with each other, or Admin sets a policy. Until then... Just CHILL.

I don't know where you are coming from with this but how you chose to pay or be paid by some one is up to you and the staff here on the forum does not have or want control over how you pay.


There is no argument here but each member can give their opinion and not all will be the same.

Travis

[Izzy]

never knew about the gift thing - nver really paid it much attention. I pay either way. If i'm selling i think i'll expect to take the fees into account.

i don't like how few companies take paypal - wish more would. unless its tower or e-bay or a member on a forum there no getting parts if your money is in paypal - dont help at the hobby store or at the hardware either.....

[WhiteWolf McBride]

Originally Posted by fhhhstix

I don't know where you are coming from with this but how you chose to pay or be paid by some one is up to you and the staff here on the forum does not have or want control over how you pay.

There is no argument here but each member can give their opinion and not all will be the same.

Travis

My apologies Travis,

I didn't mean to imply anything by the statement. Some admin like to make rules about Buy/Sell/Trade, mainly to protect their members. I was not sure if you were speaking as a member, or as Admin.

And I agree 100%, everyone is entitled to their opinion. Its when people go off onna rant, and try to make others' opinions look wrong that bothers me.

Glad to hear that Admin does not plan to make a policy on payment methods. It would be interesting to see in the buy/sell/trade feedback area that transaction particulars were noted for feliability (not amounts, but method: PayPal/Cash/Cheque/Interac/MO/whatever, and if any fees were split (like PayPal, shipping, etc.) Note it would be voluntary, but might give others some insight into safety of deals with other members, yes?

Just an idea, toss it around? (in another thread if needed?)